See that you don’t refuse him who speaks. For if they didn’t escape when they refused him who warned on the earth, how much more will we not escape who turn away from him who warns from heaven, whose voice shook the earth then, but now he has promised, saying, “Yet once more I will shake not only the earth, but also the heavens.” This phrase, “Yet once more”, signifies the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that have been made, that those things which are not shaken may remain.
Restoring Hope: Pastor Rick McNeely on Building a Spirit-Filled Community
About this episode
Pastor Rick McNeely of Christ Community Church in Murphysboro, Illinois joins Philip Cameron for a timely conversation about holding onto unshakeable faith when the world around us is in turmoil. Drawing from Hebrews 12:25-27, Rick unpacks why God allows seasons of shaking — not to harm us, but to strip away everything that cannot last so that only what is eternal remains. "We serve a God that is an anchor of our soul," Rick declares, "and he will bring you to him and hold you in the midst of turmoil and tumult." The conversation moves from Rick's bold decision to keep his church open during COVID — setting up a drive-in worship service in the parking lot when the state shut down churches while keeping taverns open — to the deeper spiritual principle that the church must never compromise its message. Rick is direct: "We're not going to Atlanta. We're talking about heaven, and there's only one way to get there, and that's through Christ." Pastor Rick also explores why fear is the enemy's primary weapon, why authentic love requires speaking truth, and how God's grip on our lives — like a grandfather holding a child's hand on a treacherous path — is always an act of love, never control. Viewers wrestling with uncertainty will find both biblical grounding and practical courage in this episode.
Part of our Faith collection of conversations.
Quotes worth sharing
“We live in a world that wants God to change to embrace their lifestyle, rather than allowing God to change their lifestyle to be able to embrace him.”
“She finally stopped. She said, 'Papa, you are dragging me.' And I looked at her and I said, 'Honey, I may be dragging you, but I'm not gonna lose you.' And I think what people have to understand is that God gets a tight grip on us because he doesn't want to lose us.”
“Do you ever stop and consider that for countries that are atheist or that outlaw God — did you ever stop and consider why they fight so hard to keep someone quiet about someone they say doesn't exist? If somebody was trying to tell me that Peter Pan was gonna show up and take us to Neverland, I wouldn't spend billions of dollars trying to shut them down. But they know — they know deep down in their heart — that the gospel will set people free.”
What's Discussed
Pastor Rick McNeely of Christ Community Church in Murphysboro, Illinois discusses the biblical framework for navigating cultural and spiritual upheaval. Anchoring the conversation in Hebrews 12:25-27, Rick argues that God is deliberately shaking everything that can be shaken so that only the eternal remains. He recounts keeping his church open during COVID by hosting drive-in worship services, citing Hebrews 10:25 on not forsaking the assembling of believers. Rick contends that fear is the enemy's chief weapon, that perfect love casts out fear, and that authentic Christian love demands speaking truth rather than affirming destructive paths. He closes with a vivid illustration of God's grip as an act of protective love.
- Rick McNeely Welcomed to the Show
- Refusing to Quit During COVID Lockdowns
- Drive-In Church and Assembling Together
- Hebrews 12 and the Divine Shaking
- Perfect Love Casts Out Fear
- Truth, Love, and the Gospel's Exclusive Claims
- God's Grip — the Granddaughter on the Snowy Path
- Paul's Serpent and Standing on the Solid Rock
Scripture in this episode
See that you don’t refuse him who speaks. For if they didn’t escape when they refused him who warned on the earth, how much more will we not escape who turn away from him who warns from heaven,
not forsaking our own assembling together, as the custom of some is, but exhorting one another; and so much the more, as you see the Day approaching.
Episode Transcript
Auto-generated · click any timestamp to jump the video
Intro
Rick McNeely Welcomed to the Show
Refusing to Quit During COVID Lockdowns
Drive-In Church and Assembling Together
Hebrews 12 and the Divine Shaking
Perfect Love Casts Out Fear
Truth, Love, and the Gospel's Exclusive Claims
God's Grip — the Granddaughter on the Snowy Path
Paul's Serpent and Standing on the Solid Rock
Common questions
Why did Pastor Rick McNeely keep his church open during COVID when other churches shut down?
Rick felt the COVID shutdowns were about more than just a health crisis — he sensed a spiritual shift in the atmosphere. When his state's governor closed churches while keeping taverns open, he called the sheriff's department to give notice and set up a drive-in church service in the parking lot, with a praise and worship team on a trailer and himself preaching from the rooftop. He grounded the decision in Hebrews' instruction not to forsake assembling together, especially as the day of the Lord approaches.
What does Rick McNeely say about the idea that there are many paths to God?
Rick pushes back on the 'many roads to heaven' argument with a pointed distinction: people say you can get to Atlanta by bus, plane, or car — but, as he puts it, 'we're not going to Atlanta.' He holds that Jesus himself said 'I am the way, the truth, and the life,' making Christ the only path to heaven. He frames this not as exclusion but as an open invitation — 'whosoever will, let them come.'
How does Rick explain what's spiritually behind all the current unrest and riots?
Rick connects the social upheaval to Hebrews 12, which describes God shaking everything that can be shaken so that only the unshakeable remains. He believes the chaos is by design — driven by people who want power and use fear as their tool — but he argues that 'perfect love casts out fear,' and that God is using the shaking to draw people to himself rather than to destroy them.
What story does Rick tell to illustrate how God holds onto us even when it feels uncomfortable?
Rick shares a memory of walking a snow-covered, treacherous path in Wyoming with his then-five-year-old granddaughter Shaylee. He held her hand tightly the whole way, and she finally protested, 'Papa, you are dragging me.' His reply was, 'Honey, I may be dragging you, but I'm not gonna lose you.' He uses that moment to illustrate how God keeps a firm grip on us — not to hurt us, but because he refuses to lose us, even when we can't see the full picture.
How does Rick respond to the charge that Christians who speak hard truths don't really love people?
Rick argues the opposite — that staying silent when someone is heading toward destruction is the real failure of love. He uses the analogy of a drowning person: 'How could I say that I love them and care about them if I'm not willing to throw them a life jacket?' He also points to how he handles his grandkids near a fireplace — he doesn't let them get close to the fire because he loves them, not in spite of it.